I was a little surprised to find a personals ad from a trans guy in a “women seeking women” forum earlier this week. Each to their own, but it’s not what I’d do. I identify as male and I don’t expect (or desire) “women seeking women” to have any romantic or sexual interest in me. Furthermore, I’d feel as though I were invading their space by posting there.
What do you think? Please leave your comments below.
Translate:
January 17th, 2010 at 2:37 pm
Not any more, in days gone past, yes. But only because I didnt see transguys being catered for.
January 17th, 2010 at 2:49 pm
I’ll give that a “Hel no.” Lesbian women who want me aren’t the women I want.
January 17th, 2010 at 5:58 pm
It would depend. If I’m looking for a queer woman then I might peruse because I enjoy queer women and not all queer women are “lesbians.” I know this as a fact because I have many queer women that are my friends who post on “women seeking women” and say they are trying to weed out the creepy men that fantasize about women being with other women. However I would never personally post a personal.
January 18th, 2010 at 4:48 am
Why do you feel so offended by some other transperson’s identity? If a trans guy wants to date a lesbian, that is fine by me. Doesn’t hurt me at all. Bravo to him for going after what he wants! I wouldn’t dare criticize him for his desires or identity.
Oh, sorry Joshua, I reread your post and realized you didn’t say offended, you said ’surprised.’ In which case, yes, I suppose it is a bit surprising. But, I too am a fan of ‘each to their own’.
January 19th, 2010 at 12:33 pm
I would post in women 4 women and I do do it. I am a trans man, and I prefer to date the queer ladies. Nothing wrong with that guys. We’ve got some great trans diversity, let’s flaunt it!
January 19th, 2010 at 1:40 pm
Thanks for your perspectives! Browsing yesterday, I came across numerous personals ads in W4W forums from trans guys, as well as ads from women looking for trans guys. Something that occurred to me is that if I were posting such an ad, I would probably consider the nature of the site I was submitting it to, to gauge the vibe of the W4W community there: Would my ad be a good fit? Or, would I be better off looking for a more queer-oriented site? The poll’s wording doesn’t take the queer factor into consideration, so thanks again for discussing this in the comments.
January 27th, 2010 at 11:02 am
I agree with Joshua. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with trans men posting on a W4W site. There are MANY lesbians who love transmen, and I’ve even met some lesbians who exclusively date transmen (figure that one out, but it works out for transmen in the end). I guess it really depends on whether or not you want to attract those women. Some transmen are really into straight women because they want to feel like “real” men. But some (like me) are really attracted to the cute bisexuals and lesbians who are attracted to me.
January 31st, 2010 at 10:14 pm
To those who responded “post on another website” may I ask, which websites are you refering to? Sorry if I seem naive, I’m a little new to my trans self and I need some advice as to where to look for people who will appreciate me… Thanks guys!
January 31st, 2010 at 10:18 pm
I haven’t used it myself Hank, but I hear TransPassions is good.
February 2nd, 2010 at 7:53 pm
Thanks for the tip Joshua!
February 3rd, 2010 at 12:16 pm
Hey all, I’m not a transguy, I just sort of came across this website and this headline caught my eye because of an experience I had a few years ago. I hope you don’t mind if I share this with you?
I partner exclusively with women, although I am butch and I tend to favor butches. Anyway, one day I was browsing craigslist and a W4W ad caught my eye. The poster said she (sorry, pronouns are tough in this case and I am inexperienced with gender-neutral pronouns, I mean no offense) was butch, dominant, experienced, and looking for a looking for a sub. I was like ‘Fantastic. Finally, the butch dom I’ve always wanted.’ So we emailed a few times and decided to meet. In a subsequent email she mentioned she’d had top surgery and was ‘a little trans.’ Exact phrasing, I still have the email. Well, I’ve partnered with butches who have had top surgery before, would maybe like to have it myself one day, and I said it was no big deal. That was all she said about her gender identity, the rest of what we talked about was the typical bdsm stuff you have to get out the way before you can play with a new friend.
Long story short, I finally meet this person, and he was totally 100% male-presenting. He had been on hormones for 10+ years, used male pronouns, used a male name. I was really not sure what to say or do. Finally, I just asked him if he was completely male identified, and he said ‘yes, basically, although my queer identity is important to me as well.’ So I asked him why he posted a W4W ad and he said it was because he was more likely to find what he was looking for (a butch or transboi) there. Completely understandable, but…
I didn’t go home with him that night. We haven’t spoken since. My bottom line is that I’m not attracted to men. We were both calm about it, but the experience left a bad taste in my mouth. On the one hand, he had said he was partially trans and so I felt guilty for rejecting him for being ‘too trans.’ I’ve been rejected for being ‘too butch’ and it hurts; I never meant to do that to someone else. On the other hand, he’d mentioned to me he had had top surgery, so why not mention the hormones? And he’d said he was ‘a little trans,’ which turned out to be a pretty drastic under-exaggeration.
It was my fault for not getting a picture first and not making it absolutely clear what my limits were in terms of gender. On the other hand, if you’re going to post a W4W ad, maybe it’d be a good idea to use full disclosure about how trans you are or aren’t before you meet the person, and find out exactly where they stand as well.
Sorry for all the pontification. Hope that was, um, illuminating, and not ignorant and offensive.
February 8th, 2010 at 5:05 pm
until there are options that include t4w, t4t, or t4m, then i say its kinda fair game to post wherever one feels is the most appropriate to their identity. just be respectful about it, isnt that a no-brainer, sheesh?!?. i guess the etiquette of yr local posting site should be considered… where i live, if yr a queer ftm looking to meet a queer lady, then w4w is where to go. I don’t know how it works if yr a straight ftm looking for a straight lady.
and also, for those of us who don’t fully pass (by choice or not by choice), then binary-presenting/passing-gender-niche-requirements could prevent us from posting anywhere safely…
March 1st, 2010 at 6:35 pm
No. The secret is in the “W” parts, which a man, generally speaking, is not. And “W4W” actually doesn’t say anything about the space being for queer identified women: it is for women who are seeking women. So men of any variety using a W4W section to troll for queer women is offensive, and kind of creepy in its own way. Another major problem I see with men posting in W4W personals, is the relatively unchallenged censoring and flagging of trans WOMEN’s adverts in the same spaces. At the very least, until all WOMEN are entitled and welcome to post freely in Women’s spaces, men have no business there. Really? Post in M4W if you are looking for a woman to connect with. Shake up that space — at least it’s honest (I.E. you are a man seeking a woman — not rocket science really), and something that is entirely reasonable for a trans man to access.
March 2nd, 2010 at 1:55 am
Eliot, not offensive (to me) at all. Women should reasonably be able to find women in a W4W section on a personals site. When men behave as though they are entitled to take up space where women haven’t even fully had the opportunity to explore and utilize it, there is a problem. An old problem, but a problem nonetheless.
March 15th, 2010 at 9:29 pm
personally i don’t think FTMs should be posting adds for themselves in W4W.
if you’re FTM you’re male.
that would be the same thing as a strait woman posing as a gay man because she has a “thing” for gay guys. once the two meet [if ever] one will probably feel disappointed and cheated. or at least that’s how i would feel if i exclusively dated in one gender and someone of the opposite gender lied to me.
March 17th, 2010 at 6:01 pm
i understand the if-you’re-ftm-you’re-male sentiment, but i understand and side with the idea of ftms using w4w as their space. though i identify as trans, i understand that i don’t quite have the ‘downstairs’ that the typical w4m is posting for. obviously this depends on the particular post and what the poster wants.
mentioning that you’re trans in any posting/reply, though you may not find it necessary, is not going to harm you. neither of you will waste any time with someone you aren’t attracted to!
as long as openness and honesty is priority, i don’t see what the problem is.
March 22nd, 2010 at 12:58 am
I am FTM and I agree with jbt. W4W sections are for women, and it takes a lot of entitlement for a trans man to post there when trans women are frequently chased away.
If someone is “trans masculine spectrum” (or whatever terms you prefer) but doesn’t identify as a man, identifies as both, etc., then I can understand posting in W4W. But someone who doesn’t identify as woman/female at all? They’re in the wrong section.
March 23rd, 2010 at 10:42 pm
I am a FtM, on hormone and done with top surgery. Physically I am always passed as a man. I always identified as one in the public but I dont mind being ‘out’ to the LGBT community. When comes to looking for friends or partner (am fine with either queer or straight women) I still look into our community group. I tried the straight classified and found out that most of the straight women disappear when the topic ‘queer’ being mentioned. Plus this straight women will start telling their friends to check and be aware of the id/name in the ad. This will lead to straight men writing in trying to be ‘God’ to change you. This is also one of the reason I am not comfortable being ‘out’ to the straight. As for W4W, the most is no response. But of course i will state clearly that I am a FtM/Transmen in such ad.
By the way, correct me if I am wrong, I dont find any ads for Transmen looking for women or women looking for Transmen in my country or neighborhood.
April 5th, 2010 at 9:15 am
I am a gay transboi, but I wouldn’t want to meet other women in a sexual content. I feel if a transman gay or not. If they are seeking a girl that should know deep inside that they are either a male or female.. I have never seen myself as anything but male, and all my partners in life have been male…
May 6th, 2010 at 3:47 am
(FYI I personally do not go for bodies or genitals or looks. But I do enjoy women more most of the time. Guys have their bonuses too; but I like boobs a lot so generally I date women. Also, I’d never put an ad in one of these things. Also I’m more genderqueer than trans.. But.. I’m leaning towards T and such, as scary as that admission is.)
SO considering my own tastes are not super-common… I guess it would depend on how far I’d transitioned. I wouldn’t want to offend anyone who WAS picky, so if I hadn’t had bottom surgery I’d advertise in the W4W or W4M column, with a note about being trans… If I had, I’d advertise in the M4W or M4M and add a note about being trans; again avoiding upsetting anyone.
It’s not because I think your junk makes you a man or a woman, but because I know that some people do, and I wouldn’t want to piss anyone off.
May 16th, 2010 at 6:24 am
I think I’d post as a guy, but I’d tell the truth. I think that I’d rather look for a site that is women looking for transmen.
May 22nd, 2010 at 1:01 pm
Posting there is fine so long as the ad is truthful, and up front. Women searching the W4W section are expecting to find biological women. If you aren’t a biological woman, just say so, so people don’t end up feeling deceived.
May 23rd, 2010 at 6:26 pm
So where does a woman who wants to date a FtM go? I can’t seem to get connected.
June 14th, 2010 at 11:54 am
I have an ad on a W4W site and have met a few queer women who are interested & interesting-my ad states right on it that I am transgender and I have my photo up so they know what I look like.
I prefer to date queer women and the one site that I have had success with happens to be a W4W site.
July 6th, 2010 at 6:48 pm
Obviously the biggest problem here is that gender is still seen as male or female. Transgender or gender queer people of the world are still forced to define themselves as either male or female regardless of what their body looks like or how they feel inside. I am a trans guy, I prefer to present as male but I also appreciate and indulge my female side as well. While I have no interest in existing as a conventional woman, there are parts of my soul that are definitely more feminine than masculine, (again as defined by tradition and culture). I am a guy who loves a lot of the “boy stuff” but also has a crafty lady and a thrifty shopper sharing this body. Why isn’t there is a place where someone can just talk about WHO they are without having to define WHAT they are? If that was the case maybe people could open their minds and learn to LOVE someone they might never have dated. Sure you know what you’re looking for but if the package it comes is the only thing keeping you from it….
July 7th, 2010 at 7:40 am
I posted on the M4W before and had no luck (I was honest about myself). So than I posted on the W4W and got a few responses from some bi girls…one whom I have been with for over 2 yrs now.
July 13th, 2010 at 4:05 am
I think it’s inappropriate for FTM guys to post in a W4W forum intended for women. If you are FTM you identify as a male in terms of gender, so no matter what your sexuality is ie what you’re attracted to, you should only be posting on M4W or M4M forums.
Otherwise it’s a bit creepy, like you’re posing as someone you’re not, with intention to mislead the other unsuspecting party.
Not a gentleman thing to do at all.